The Sunday Sermon
by OneVike
Of the seven churches addressed by John, the fourth church, Thyatira, is the smallest yet it received the longest message. (Rev 2:18-29) This corrupt church was located 42 miles inland from the Aegean Sea in an alluvial plain between the Hermus and Calcius rivers . There were no natural geographical formations like steep mountains or deep rivers to provide it with a good base from which to defend its position. Its sole purpose was to act as the first line of defense in front of a hostile advancing army and to hinder their movement while the kingdom's main forces were mustered deeper behind the battlefront.
The history of Thyatira consists of being controlled by the leading powers of the time, whether it was Alexander's Greece, the Pergamon Kingdom, Antiochene empire, or the Roman Empire. Because it was so easily overrun, for most of it's history it remained a relatively small city compared to that of Ephesus and Pergamum. However, after Rome introduced Pax Romana, it settled into becoming a fairly peacefull city that boasted more trade guilds than in any other Asian city of its time. From excavated coins it is evident that guilds of carpenters, tent makers, bakers, bronze smiths, wool workers, potters, linen weavers, tanners and the famous dyers of purple were all active in the city. Lydia the seller of purple was from this city (Act 16:14). We do not know if this church was founded by Lydia or not, but it did grow in time to be a very wealthy church. Unfortunately it probably grew wealthy because of its members compromising their values by listening to the advice of a certain prophetess.
As in the rest of the Asian province, guilds, or trade unions, would often hold banquets for its members. These banquets included the eating of food offered to idols and the participation in immoral sexual acts. Coming to Christ meant the loss of their livelihood and financial resources for the Church if they abstained from the communal feasts. However, participation would be tantamount to renouncing the very faith they had come to accept, thus denying the One who suffered and died for them. A prophetess named Jezebel, managed to work out a theology that allowed them to compromise their faith in Christ with continued participation in the local trade unions, and that meant continued financial prosperity and material wealth.
In the Old Testament, Jezebel was the wife of King Ahab, who became a puppet in her hands for working all wickedness in the sight of Jehovah (1Kings 21:25). She established the Phoenician idolatry on a grand scale at her husband's court, maintaining at her table 450 prophets of Baal and 400 of Astarte (1Kings 16:31-32, 1Kings 18:19, 1Kings 18:13). Since that time, the name Jezebel has been known in history as the representative of all that is designing, crafty, malicious, revengeful, cruel, and immoral. We do not know if this prophetess's real name was Jezebel or if Christ used the name as a description for the type of woman she was. What we do know is that this Jezebel was very influential in leading members of the church into immoral practices with the above mentioned guilds for various pagan gods.
When people deliberately reject the Lord's authority, He is no longer their God. The result is that they must find another god, for it is impossible for the human spirit to live without something to live for. That is the very root of what a god is. That which you worship and live for, that which makes living worthwhile to you, becomes your god. It could be the god of entertainment, like sports, video games, and television, or the god of sexual pleasure, the god of money and wealth, or even the god of ambition that one worships trying to attain fame and fortune. The point is, wherever or whatever you direct your strongest energy towards, that will become the place of greatest temptation in this regard. It would be wise to remember, that the beast you feed will be the one that grows the strongest in your life. In Thyatira, accept for a few faithful, the members of the church were more interested in keeping their jobs than following the true God's commandments. And so, their jobs and their status became their god, while Jezebel was the person Christ pointed to as the reason for their stumbling due to her actions and refusal to repent.
I gave her time to repent of her sexual immorality, and she did not repent. Indeed I will cast her into a sickbed, and those who commit adultery with her into great tribulation, unless they repent of their deeds. I will kill her children with death, and all the churches shall know that I am He who searches the minds and hearts. (Rev 2:21-23)
Because Jezebel did not repent of her evils, Christ warns of a certain punishment for her by using a strong Hebraic term that means to "kill" with a most sure and awful form of death. There is also a punishment for those who either commit sins with her, or are led into the same kind of lifestyle if they refuse to repent. As for the words "children" used in verse 23, there is a debate as to whether the words are to be taken literally or figuratively. The word itself could be interpreted either way and there is nothing in the context, nor in the original language, that can be correctly determined. I must also point out that there is precedence to show that other passages in the Scriptures have both literal and figurative meaning, a prime example would be these letters to the seven churches.
Now if the word "children" is to be taken literally, it is in accordance with what is often threatened in the Scriptures, that children shall be visited with calamity for the sin's of their parents. This is not to say that I believe in generational curses, but the very actions of parents do affect the lives of their children. Children of alcoholic or drug addicted parents would be an excellent example of this, because it is not uncommon for whole families to suffer from a parent's neglect due to their addictions. The other side of this debate comes from the understanding that the use of the word "children" is to be taken figuratively. Children would refer to those who have been so infected by Jezebel's doctrines that they would themselves be propagators of this false teaching that has so infected this church. An example would be the way false denominations have begun from the teachings of just a few, or even one misguided individual like the Mormon's Joseph Smith, or Arianism which denies the doctrine of the trinity, this heresy was first propagated by Arius in the 4th century. As for the reference of the word "death", it alludes to a judgment so severe that it would serve as a stern warning to other churches to beware of such practices.
Prophetically, Thyatira represents the church age from about the 6th to the 16th century, a thousand years that I like to refer to as the "The Devil's Millennium". It was a time when the church became corrupt by combining pagan rites and Christian teaching. Many heathen rituals were introduced into the churches that in time were accepted as being Biblical. These practices included the worshiping of images, the selling of indulgences to buy ones way out of hell, and various other practices of the priests which were unknown to the early church but gained approval during the devil's millennium. In time it became difficult to distinguish the clergy from the corrupt monarchs, as political power by religious authorities was widely sought. Like the church of Thyatira this age was truly corrupt and dark, as the Light did not burn very bright. Thus we have the term that aptly describes this time, at least the first 500 years or so, as the "Dark Ages".
The range of praise regarding Thyatira's spiritual status was perhaps the widest given to any of the seven churches, and it is also the only church that is said to have improved its spiritual condition. However, all the good works were being overshadowed by their inability to smell the stench coming from the practices of those who were corupting it from within. So while Christ did give praise for their love, faith, service, and perseverance, because they did not repent He eventually removed their lampstand. This was a warning Christ gave to the church of Ephesus if they did not return to their first love (Rev 2:5). Now all that remains of this once busy and wealthy church, is stone and dust to mark the place where it once existed. Christians must understand that we can either become corrupt like the Thyatirans or stand fast against the evils and temptations of the world. Ultimately though, the life we live in the world is but a proving ground, and we will be tested daily so that on judgement day we can stand before Christ and hear the words every Christian looks forward to, "Well done good and faithful servant, you may enter my rest". For those of us who do overcome, we will have it accounted to us for righteousness and receive the Morning Star, Christ Himself. (Rev 22:16)
I pray that those who have ears to hear, will hear His voice and call upon the name of the Lord Jesus Christ.
Amen
Good reading, you have truly blessed this old lady with your messages.
Thanks you OV.
I second that, another home run for the good guy!
When I think of corrupt churches of our day, I cannot escape the evil that has been brought upon the Lutheran church by them stating that they will now ordain practicing homosexuals. That is like saying we will now ordain practicing serial killers, practicing thieves, practicing adulterers, practicing drunks, practicing bullies, etc. etc. etc.
What part of 1 Corinthians 6:9 did the Lutheren leaders not understand? Or are they just going to eliminate large portions of Scriptures now?
Do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived. Neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor homosexuals, nor sodomites, nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners will inherit the kingdom of God. 1Corinthians 6:9-10
Anyway, good article OV, and you truly are a well versed man in the Word.
By the way my Father is still alive and he still preaches, although not as the head pastor no more. He stepped down because of the lack of energy as he gets older. I turned him onto your articles and he is very impressed. Coming from my Dad, well let me just say that he can be a hard person to impress sometimes.
When people deliberately reject the Lord's authority, He is no longer their God. The result is that they must find another god, for it is impossible for the human spirit to live without something to live for. That is the very root of what a god is. That which you worship and live for, that which makes living worthwhile to you, becomes your god. It could be the god of entertainment, like sports, video games, and television, or the god of sexual pleasure, the god of money and wealth, or even the god of ambition that one worships trying to attain fame and fortune. The point is, wherever or whatever you direct your strongest energy towards, that will become the place of greatest temptation in this regard. It would be wise to remember, that the beast you feed will be the one that grows the strongest in your life.
This whole paragraph is very profound. Would you mind if I used it in a paper I am writing for a class I am taking on Philosophy? I promise to give you due credit.
a theology that allowed them to compromise their faith in Christ with continued participation in the local trade unions, and that meant continued financial prosperity and material wealth.
Wow, the more things change the more they stay the same. Just like then, unions today corrupt everything they get involved in.
Thyatira sounds a lot like the ELCA!
Angry Lutheran speaking here!
Excellent article, until the very end.
“Like the church of Thyatira this age was truly corrupt and dark, as the Light did not burn very bright. Thus we have the term that aptly describes this time, at least the first 500 years or so, as the “Dark Ages”.”
Why would any true Christian adopt the terminology of the atheist and manifestly anti-Christian Gibbon?
Secondly, adopting this approach manifestly ignores the church in Christendom, and is extremely offensive to Catholics. Why is it necessary for Protestants to cast aspersions on Catholic practice?
Thyatira sounds a lot like the ELCA!
Angry Lutheran speaking here!
Yes, another church that is failing to smell the stench from within. Now they are allowing practicing homosexuals to become ordained ministers.
I was raised in the Lutheran denomination, I had left it when I was in my early 20’s back in the “70”s, but I still have many relatives who are clueless and still attending.
I call them bench-warmers, because the only thing that seems to happen when they attend services is the bench gets a little warmer. They are obviously not doing their part in reading the word and praying or else they would replace their leaders who are doing what Thyarira did, compromising to the point that they have become corrupt.
Tom said it right when he asked, What part of 1 Corinthians 6:9 did the Lutheran leaders not understand? Or are they just going to eliminate large portions of Scriptures now?
"That is like saying we will now ordain practicing serial killers, practicing thieves, practicing adulterers, practicing drunks, practicing bullies, etc. etc. etc."
No, it's not, because loving someone who happens to be of the same gender is not at all the same as killing, stealing, cheating, getting drunk all the time, or bullying people, and any person who stops for five seconds to use their God-given heart and mind rather than believing everything they read in one book because their daddy told them that if they didn't they would suffer forever can understand this very simple truth.
I love it when someone who claims to know what the Bible says refutes everything it says in one statement. Why would you agree with a book like the Bible when you are not a Christian? Yet you write comment after comment as if you know that what Christians believe in, is not in the Bible.
K, you do not have to agree with me about who Christ is or that He is the Son of God, but do not claim that the Bible does not explicitly say what it does. You and Quentin are quite the pair, you want to have your cake and eat it to, but you cannot.
The bottom line is this, in God's eyes no sin is greater than another, some are more damaging to society, but sin is sin. Christ died for all sin, and only those who repent and turn from there sin will be forgiven and attain eternal life in His presence.
However, if you would rather not be in the presence of God, than He will grant your desire and remove you from His presence for eternity. You will get what you ultimately desire. After all, if you do not wish to accept His laws here, why would you want to be forced to accept them in heaven, because in heaven there will be no free will. You must remember that God is not a cosmic rapist, He will not force His love upon you. If you want nothing to do with Him here, then He will have nothing to do with you there, you will be forever separated from His love and care.
This world is the place you decide if you want Him, not the other way around, and you decide by either following His laws, or not. It is ultimately your decision, but what ever you decide, do not claim that His book does not say what it says.
Sue, I would be honored for you to use my words in your paper.
However, they are just words and I do not need to be credited with them. After all, I probably heard the same thing said in different words by someone in my past yet I could not say who. I will never make a living off my words, so I do not expect you or anyone else to ever be bound by any copyright laws or demands for credit from me.
God knows where the thought came from, and all glory ultimately goes to Him. Good luck and blessings upon your grade.
OV--"I love it when someone who claims to know what the Bible says refutes everything it says in one statement. Why would you agree with a book like the Bible when you are not a Christian? Yet you write comment after comment as if you know that what Christians believe in, is not in the Bible.
K, you do not have to agree with me about who Christ is or that He is the Son of God, but do not claim that the Bible does not explicitly say what it does. "
I don't know who the strawman is that you've been arguing with today, but it's not me. I didn't make any claims about what the Bible did or did not say. I was responding using logic and reason, and I made it abundantly clear that I don't really give a damn what it says in your ancient book. (I hate to disparage people's Holy Texts this way, but sometimes people like you need a little perspective.)
I also never said that I don't believe Jesus is the Son of God. I am open to possibility--which, to quote "Joan of Arcadia," may just be God's favorite instrument.
This is the second time today you've completely made up some ridiculous argument and attributed it to me. If you continue to do this instead of actually engaging with the points I make, I am not going to waste my time replying to you anymore.
"The bottom line is this, in God's eyes no sin is greater than another,"
I can't accept that this is true. It doesn't make sense to me. Maybe some day I'll be proven wrong, but for now I have to go with what my heart and mind tell me.
"because in heaven there will be no free will."
I disagree with this as well.
"You and Quentin are quite the pair, you want to have your cake and eat it to, but you cannot."
I can't speak for Quentin, but I don't think this is true of me. I simply acknowledge the fact that I don't really know what kind of cake I'm even going to get, or if the cake even exists at all.
OK, than do not engage me in Christian theology unless you are willing to actually look into the facts about the arguments you are arguing against. I ask you, no I challenge you again to show one thing in the Bible that is wrong or contradictory. You tried before and failed, if you really want to prove the Bible is wrong, and I mean outside of your touchy felly desires for it to be wrong, than prove it.
You see, you want a religion that is made up in your head, one that agrees with whatever moralistic ideas you want to live by. You do not wish to have standards that you do not like, so you disagree with the standards society has properly functioned with for centuries. Like it or not, but every good standard in society that even you like such as Hospital care, charity, loving strangers, and enemies, forgiveness, goodwill, etc. etc. etc. has been brought into our society by the Christian faith. With out the benefits of the Christian faith, the society you live in would be very harsh.
Yet people like you want to eliminate from influence the very faith which has brought this Country and the world to the level of decency it enjoys. All the evil is brought on by other religions, not Christianity. Oh, are their bad Christians? Yes, just as there are bad cops, bad firemen, bad teachers, bad bakers, and even bad dressmakers. People are evil not Christianity. I just finished a whole series on how control of Christianity by one church for a thousand years became a bad thing. That is why God allowed the reformation.
I can honestly say that, in the flesh there are many standards I do not like, but I also understand that they are needed because we as humans have proved time and time again that we will do some pretty weird things when allowed. In time our perception of reality will even be twisted because we have pushed the envelope beyond what is healthy until we destroy our selves.
So as an admitted sinner, I accept the standards that God has set for me to follow. Fortunately He knows I will stumble and fail from time to time and that is why His Son had to die as the perfect sacrifice for my ability to be forgiven for my inability to be perfect.
I would rather live and follow the most consistent God and religion the world has ever seen than make my own religion up and find out I was not a god who decides what will be in the end. Be fearful of the fact that you may be wrong, because deep down inside you know what is right, otherwise you would not even contemplate the idea that you might be wrong.
I do not ever contemplate that my faith in Christ as the Son of God is wrong, I know who He is, because historicity and facts are on my God's side. When ever challenged, I know He will give me the insight and knowledge to defend the truth. So the challenge is in your court, but remember when it comes to Scripture being the inspired Word of God I will barrow a quote from Martin Luther , "my conscience is taken captive by God's word.....On this I take my stand."
"if you really want to prove the Bible is wrong, and I mean outside of your touchy felly desires for it to be wrong, than prove it."
I have neither the interest nor the obligation to "prove" that a 2000 year old book is wrong.
"You see, you want a religion that is made up in your head, one that agrees with whatever moralistic ideas you want to live by. You do not wish to have standards that you do not like, so you disagree with the standards society has properly functioned with for centuries."
I think for myself. Your religion calls that Original Sin.
I call it a virtue.
"Like it or not, but every good standard in society that even you like such as Hospital care, charity, loving strangers, and enemies, forgiveness, goodwill, etc. etc. etc. has been brought into our society by the Christian faith."
Utterly ridiculous.
"Yet people like you want to eliminate from influence the very faith which has brought this Country and the world to the level of decency it enjoys."
I don't want to "eliminate" anything.
"Be fearful of the fact that you may be wrong, because deep down inside you know what is right, otherwise you would not even contemplate the idea that you might be wrong."
That makes absolutely no sense. It is normal to contemplate the idea that you might be wrong. Thinking you may be wrong and knowing you are wrong are two very different things.
"I do not ever contemplate that my faith in Christ as the Son of God is wrong,"
That's because you are an arrogant jerk with no shred of humility.
I would be honored for you to use my words in your paper. However, they are just words and I do not need to be credited with them.
I could never consider not giving you credit, I look to you as my online theologian when I need information. Your articles here and the ones you have on your blog are priceless.
Besides, if I failed to give you credit I would probably get an "F" on my paper, because my instructor has mentioned you before when speaking of credible references. I think he knows you, but I'll leave it at that.
Thanks.
Sue