THE SUNDAY MESSAGE
by One Vike
Why does God allow there to be evil in the world? After all, are we not all created in the image of god? Many ask, and few seem to have good answers, for why God didn't just create us so that we would never have to experience pain, suffering, and sadness. He has the power to make the world free of evil, yet He chose instead make us creatures with free will. Thus, free will was the door left open for the possibility of evil to exist. If we have the right to chose between right and wrong, there is a 50% chance that we will chose to do the wrong thing and thus suffer the consequences of our sin. But why did He not just make us all good? Why must we live with the possibility that we, and others, may chose to do something that will harm us and the world we live in. After all, is he not a loving God? Either He's not as powerful as we're led to believe, not as perfect as we're led to believe, or He's just another abusive father who enjoys watching his children suffer. What's the purpose? Why does God allow evil and suffering?
God could have made us perfect without the ability to sin, and we would have never known pain and suffering. To do so however, would have meant that we would not have free choice in whether or not we would love Him. We would be like Chatty Cathy dolls mimicking whatever it is He wanted to hear us say and forcing us to do exactly what he wanted us to do. Is that the kind of life you would wish to live? Well, obviously God did not think so; He made us creatures with a free will. That free will allowed Adam and Eve to disobey of their own volition and partake of the tree of knowledge of good and evil. They exercised the right of choice that God had given them. They could have refused to disobey God's command about the fruit, but they did not. Because they didn't, we have the sin that has been passed down. All of us, believers and non-believers alike, wrestle with the daily struggles of the "Adam and Eve" within us. Only through the power of Jesus' Holy Spirit in us can we truly have victory over the nature that was handed down to us.
As Christians, we should all know this already, but so many cannot complete the picture when they face sorrow and pain. This is why so many Christians inevitably ask the question, "Why am I suffering God? Why do my loved ones suffer?" But wait... there's more. What if on the day we accepted Christ as our Lord and Savior, we were given God's total and complete protection, so nothing bad ever happened to us again? Well, do you remember what Satan said to God about Lot?
"Does Job fear God for nothing? Have You not made a hedge about him and his house and all that he has, on every side? You have blessed the work of his hands, and his possessions have increased in the land. But put forth Your hand now and touch all that he has; he will surely curse You to Your face." Job 1:9-11
Can you imagine what would happen if God did put a hedge about us on every side? Would not the people of the world who do not know Christ, say:
"So what, that you love God. Anybody would love God if He protected them the way He does you. I'm not impressed. Your God doesn't offer me anything; I live in the real world."
However, what if on the other hand, those people were watching us suffer? They saw the way we dealt with the same issues of pain, suffering and disappointment as they deal with. Yet we still looked to our Father in heaven with love and gratefulness for His loving mercy that allows us to be free enough to learn and grow through our trials and tribulations. Consider the following passages, the next time you ask, why does God allow pain and suffering in a Christian's life?
There was the time when the apostles were flogged and ordered not to speak in the name of Jesus. When they were released they considered it worthy to be able to suffer for the name of Christ. Acts 5:40-42 We are told by Christ that when people persecute us and falsely say all kinds of evil against us because of Him, that we should "Rejoice and be glad, for your reward in heaven will be great." Matthew 5:11-12 James tells us that we should consider it all joy when we encounter various trials, knowing that the testing of our faith produces endurance. James 1:2-4 These and other passages like them describe rejoicing, not in spite of the suffering, but because of it. Remember what Paul says about not losing heart over the fact that our flesh is decaying with age and infirmities,
"...because our trials will renew our spirit daily............for the things which are seen are temporal, but the things which are not seen are eternal," 2 Cor 4:16-18
This is the same man who just a few short paragraphs later described the many trials and tribulations he went through. He endured imprisonments, beatings with whips and rods, he was stoned not once but three times and left for dead. Three times he was shipwrecked, threatened by robbers, Gentiles, Jews, attacked by wild animals, bitten by a poisonous snake, left cold, hungry, thirsty, and suffered many other hardships for the gospel of Christ. 2 Cor 11:23-27 Through it all Paul ran the race well. People saw that his faith in God was persistent, consistent, and profound. And they learned to trust Paul's God, not in spite of his pain and misery, but Praise God, because of it. Paul was the greatest and most successful evangelical missionary preacher the world had ever seen. It was his suffering along with that of the other apostles that eventually changed an empire. Tertullian said that, "The blood of the martyrs is the seed of the Church". It is through times of struggle and hardships that we as Christians can shine the brightest and reach more of the lost, that is, if we react to our pain and suffering in the way Christ did.
Use the comfort you get from God in your suffering as training so you might comfort others. Teach those who don't know the Lord to lean on Him in their suffering by leaning on Him in yours. Show them that you love Him and trust Him and know that He'll see you through even this. Bring them to Him as your faithful, loving father in your times of trouble. Show them who He is. Remember that we as Christians, must willingly approach our infirmities and hardships, knowing that we hold a greater prize before us after this life than this world can ever offer. That is what we have to teach the world. So ask not why you suffer, but praise God for the chance to shine and be an example as our Lord was for us.
But you may then reply that your suffering from a debilitating disease or terrible accident is not truly suffering for Christ sake. Oh, but your sufferings certainly are. Why? Because people are watching you and they are seeing how you as a Christian respond to the cruelty of this world. In your suffering, you need Him more than ever. Show them what a wonderful, comforting Lord you have. Give purpose and meaning to your suffering. Remember that the good times will never be as productive for Him as your bad times will be. Rejoice that Jesus has considered you worthy of suffering in His name. Carry your infirmity and shame with a sense of worthiness so that you may be perfect and complete, lacking in nothing. For a day will come when you shall be given a crown of righteousness, and forever your pain and suffering shall be over and forgotten, as you spend eternity in the presence of the great, I Am.
I pray that those who have ears to hear will hear His voice and call upon the name of the Lord Jesus Christ. Amen
(Should anyone desire prayer, or would like to discuss, on a personal level, your desire to learn more about salvation and what Christ has to offer. You can email me at ( onevike@gmail.com ). All information will be kept in strict confidentiality.)
God allows you to suffer to teach you character and to grow in character.
Of course, if one wants to wallow in pity for all the suffering then you just become a caricature.
We have free will but the wonder is why did God give us free will?
Actually, the question is
"Why does God allow/permit the righteous to suffer and the wicked to prosper.
This is a nice attempt, but unfortunately all attempts to explane the suffering in this world will fall short of someones expectations. (and I understand you were specifically speaking of Christians)
I guess we all desire to know why suffering happens because we all suffer to a certain degree and we are looking for someone to direct the answer to our specific need. I think that is why the bigger question we hear more often than not is, "Why does God allow the innocent to suffer, and why are children allowed to be brutalized and killed by God?"
For me the answer is rather simple, but I am sure others will disagree with me for the reason i stated above. I think the answer lies in the a basic math principle "Infinity".
Think about this for a moment if you will, heaven is eternal life in God’s love. An infinite immersion in all that is good. Any finite quantity becomes zero *when compared to infinity*. Any mathematician worth his salt will tell you that X over infinity is zero for all finite values of X, be it one, one hundred, or one hundred trillion.
That means that any amount of finite suffering we experience in this life becomes irrelevant if we except Jesus and ascend to Heaven. The innocent are guaranteed access to Heaven, so their suffering, too, becomes zero when they enter the eternal. No one in Heaven could ever look back at worldly suffering and think it relevant in relation to the eternal.
One final analogy: it’s akin to me asking you for a mundane penny in return for a trillion dollars. That’s an exceptionally good return, right? Except it’s greater than that because a trillion dollars might run out, but God’s love never does.
Just a thought. Good message OV.
You have a beautiful way with words and your heart is obviously filled with God’s love. Thanks for posting this, OneVike.
“Today I take in the question of, “Why does God allow Christians to suffer?””
God is a guy. Once he has you he loses interest and I think the key to having salvation and a happy life is hiding a bit of yourself from God and making Him chase you a little.
I came to the realization that God doesn't "allow" suffering he accepts it as an inevitable part of His creation. God's greatness is immeasurable, of course. I don't mean to imply that He lacks the ability to stop an event from happening or cause the miraculous to occur, He does. But what would life be like if God intervened? What lesson is to be learned when consequences and risk are minimized?
Once "up has been created, "down" is also present. Once "joy" is created, "sadness" is also present. And so it goes. As Dr. Beckner indicates, whatever we suffer here will ultimately be insignificant. Perhaps the question should be, what is the purpose of our lives? The Bible indicates that God's greatest desire is that we come to know and love Him. The creation itself, our various trials, and what we choose to do in every circumstance of our lives all present opportunities to grow in that direction.
He gave us a tool to guide us in this risky adventure. The Bible is wisdom and contains all of the comfort, advice, and answers we need. The better we understand what He is telling us in His book, the more we experience grace as we live our lives and mark the hours that move us toward eternal peace and love.
Good post OV.
We have free will but the wonder is why did God give us free will?
With out free will we would be robots, and God would be a cosmic rapist forcing his love upon us. Would you not want your spouse to willingly love you? Or do you force your love?
This world is like dating, when we have lived and decided, than we get married, but in the Christians perspective we marry Christ and than the dating is over. However during the dating process we had free will to chose who our lover would be. This world or Christ.
I chose Christ out of my own free will that was granted to me by God.
Who do you chose?
Of course, if one wants to wallow in pity for all the suffering then you just become a caricature.
Yeah, but Job was stuck. He couldn't do much of anything until he physically felt better. Him praying for his friends seemed to be what triggered his bodily and financial restoration. But really, for the longest time, isn't it true to say that he pretty much wallowed in his own suffering? I mean, sure, he was asking a lot of questions and praying, but he was still stuck for a long time.
"Why does God allow/permit the righteous to suffer and the wicked to prosper".
The wicked only think they are prospering, it all comes down to what you consider to be prosperous. Jesus owned nothing, traveled less than 30 miles from his birth place, yet he was richer than the emperor of Rome.
Bill Gates, George Soros, and others like them are not better off than I am, they just have more temptation to sin, and thus a more difficult time lies before them when they need to get through that needle.
To me it is all perspective, what do you treasure and hold onto to? This world is passing and that is the lesson we should grasp from the pain and suffering we endure. Someday the pain for the followers of Christ will be over, but those who think they are well off yet do not accept Him. Well my friend, their suffering has just begun.
I had to come back and ask another question. You still have not answered my first one. Maybe you can take them both together and give me an answer.
I also would like to know,
"Why did God permit his Son to die? Why could he not just offer forgiveness to those who wish to have it. After all, if it is all based upon faith, and Christians say God can read the heart, then why not offer it to those who truly need and desire it?"
I am not being argumentative, I honestly would like to know, along with the free will question I asked. I know how these blogs work, and that it may be a day or two before you get to the answer, so I'll check back periodically.
Yeah, but Job was stuck........Him praying for his friends seemed to be what triggered his bodily and financial restoration.
Job was stuck alright, but it was more than just his present pain and misery that kept him down. The lesson you should take from Job, besides the lesson we learn to persevere in our suffering, is that Job was stuck on his self righteousness, and it wasn't until he realized that he was nothing that God lifted his plight. However, Job thought that his own self righteousness was enough, but only the righteousness of God through Christ can save, not our own. Job finally admits it and like I said God than lifts the plight off of him.
Many Christians are where Job was. They think that they are so righteous that they are better then other Christians who seem to always struggle. Thus we have this division of status in churches even. The Pharisees suffered from this and Jesus pointed it out. Self righteousness is a big downfall for those who think they are better than they truly are. That is why we are told that the best of our works are but dirty rags.
Not by works, but by faith shall we be saved and when all Christians ultimately learn that, then they will be truly set free from the bondage odf self righteousness that many well off and decent Christians still suffer from like Job finally realized.
If we have the right to chose between right and wrong, there is a 50% chance that we will chose to do the wrong thing and thus suffer the consequences of our sin.
But this does not hold true for liberals and their elitist political representatives...
1) they do not know right from wrong OR claim that the difference is a matter of opinion or a “gray area”,
2) they chose the wrong thing nearly 100% of the time,
3) there is rarely, if ever, any consequences to those choices.
If we have the right to chose between right and wrong, there is a 50% chance that we will chose to do the wrong thing and thus suffer the consequences of our sin.
But this does not hold true for liberals and their elitist political representatives...
1) they do not know right from wrong OR claim that the difference is a matter of opinion or a “gray area”,
2) they chose the wrong thing nearly 100% of the time,
3) there is rarely, if ever, any consequences to those choices.
"Why did God permit his Son to die?"
Hmmm. Are you implying that Christ is dead? Mere coporeal death is nothing to a supernatural Christian. I mean, people die all the time. It is obviously inevitable. The question (or answer if you will), is what happens after physical death.
To a Christian, physical death ain’t no big thing. Why should it be any different for one of God’s aspects (Jesus)? Being a supernatural being by nature, physical death would have no effect. It’s just a change in packaging.
One should never be terribly bound to our current container. After all, we’re just passing through. I’m not terribly concerned that my earthly vessel is temporally limited. Why would Christ/God view physical existence to be any different? After all, God’s already been doing the supernatural thing for long enough to have a handle on it.
As for the rest of you question, I think I'll leave it to Pastor OV to answer.
Basically, the reason Jesus had to die for our sins was so that we could be forgiven and go to be with the Lord. Jesus is God in flesh (John 1:1; John 1:14; Col. 2:9) and only God can satisfy the Law requirements of a perfect life and perfect sacrifice that cleanses us of our sins.
All people have sinned against God. But, God is infinitely holy and righteous. He must punish the sinner, the Law- breaker. If He didn't, then His law is not Law for there is no law that is a law without a punishment. The punishment for breaking the Law is death, separation from God. Therefore, we sinners need a way to escape the righteous judgment of God. Since we are stained by sin and cannot keep the Law of God, then the only one who could do what we cannot is God Himself. That is why Jesus is God in flesh. He is both divine and human. He was made under the Law (Gal 4:5-6) and He fulfilled it perfectly. Therefore, His sacrifice to God the Father on our behalf is of infinite value and is sufficient to cleanse all people from their sins and undo the offense to God.
I could go more into it if you like. So if you still have questions Jethro let me know or email me here and I will answer any and all questions you have.
But this does not hold true for liberals and their elitist political representatives
Actually, they can chose to do right and thus is the reason we see non Christians treating people better than some Christians, but the difference is on judgment day who do you call Lord?
The annals of history are replete with good people who made all the right choices in this world accept for one. They did not chose Christ as their Lord and Savior, thus on judgment day they will be cast in the same lake of fire as the those who lived lives of evil, not my words, the words of Jesus. Secularists do not wish to hear this, but there is but one door, and that is through Christ Jesus who said,
But I do agree that as a Christian we have a better chance of being right more than 50% of the time when we listen to Christ, but many Christians still do not listen to Him, thus so many Christians have troubles brought upon by their own bad choices.
“Him praying for his friends seemed to be what triggered his bodily and financial restoration.“
Thus the paradox. Some of the things God requires seems counter-intuitive because of our ingrained worldly value system. If we are suffering from persecution, we are to pray for our enemies. I suppose to give them a chance to repent but at the same time it is pretty difficult to ignore our own predicament and follow Jobs actions and ask why. Only through the Holy Spirit will we be able to overcome.
I would not have the strength of my faith, the wisdom nor the love for my Lord today had I not been allowed to experience trials, tribulations and suffering in my life through the years.
I am who I am today BECAUSE of my experiences. God has been faithful through everything and has never forsaken me. I have gone through times of doubts, as everyone who is honest must admit. But through it all I have learned to trust, rest and rely on the promises of a merciful and loving Creator who created me for a purpose. Praise his Holy name!
Nancy is right, you have such a beautiful way of weaving words together. Good message OV, thanks.
“Him praying for his friends seemed to be what triggered his bodily and financial restoration. “
Thus the paradox. Some of the things God requires seems counter-intuitive because of our ingrained worldly value system.
Again I must reiterate that Job was suffering from self righteousness, he was not healed because he prayed for the others. He prayed for the others after God showed him his fault and God told him to. So Job was a dutiful man and prayed for the other three as he was instructed to do. I am sure that if Job refused to obey God and decided not to pray for his so-called friends, that God may not have restored him, but then again He may have restored Job regardless.
The point I am making, is that Job was healed by the grace of God because God wanted to heal him. There is nothing we can do, and that is what Job learned through his trials. All his good works and deeds and prayers were no better than a woman's menstruation rag, as the Scriptures point out.
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Now just so someone does not think I am being rude for using such a term as woman's menstruation rag. Allow me to present to you a little lesson in the Hebrew language.
In the New American Standard Bible with concordance numbers, Isaiah 64:6 says this about that which we think is our righteousness,
So the Hebrew word translated into filthy here was from the Hebrew word, H5713c - עדּה or iddah. Looking at the accompanying concordance we see that the Hebrew word iddah was an unused word at the time. Unused by the masses but still used by religious Prophets and Religious scribes. It was not a word you used in public and so the people would not use the word in public. (the more things change the more they same the same). However I digress, the word translates into - menstruation however. So the translators used a word that was common to use in those days which is the word filthy.
Now we have the word garment, and the Hebrew word it comes from is H899b - בּגד or beged. Looking at the accompanying concordance we see that the Hebrew word beged means a few things depending on the context. So we have various words to chose from such as, a garment as used in this context because of what the word proceeding it was and what Isaiah was talking about. There are also such words as, covering, cloth, clothes, clothing, garment, garments, lap, robes, saddle cloths, and wardrobe. You can see no other word would fit the context it was used in here.
I only did this for those who may have a problem with my choice of words to describe mans righteousness which is usually accompanied by our works, and Job thought his righteousness was good enough, but he learned that is was not.
I also enjoy it when I get a chance to use the things I have learned in Hebrew or Greek. It is said that you lose that which you do not use, so I need to practice now and then.
First of all, in order to shade light on this topic, we need to analyze separately the concepts of “good”, “evil”, and “suffering”.
What is good? What is evil?
The concepts of good and evil vary according to the different epochs, countries, morals.
For many people “good” is only a paraenesis, an exhortation.
In the Catholic world there are two main streams: The deontological and the teleological. The former maintains the individual in order to reach the good has to follow the precepts and the commandments, the latter asses that what it matters is the end of the action apart of the ethic rules. If our aim is good, we are realizing the God’s will even if we do not follow His commandments.
According to the Buddhist teachings, neither good nor evil exist, but only ignorance and delusions.
On the other hand suffering is part of the life. Suffering is life. Ageing, sickness, death are suffering. We cannot eliminate the suffering from the earth , because – only God knows why- we live in this space-temporal dimension. Once a great Pope said: “ Whoever wants realize the paradise on the earth will bring only the hell”.
Maybe in another dimension there is not good, evil, suffering but only and simply the life!
The book I have recently written may help in this direction and I want to draw it to your attention, as you may be interested in it. The title is “Travels of the Mind” If you have any questions, I am most willing to offer my views on this topic.
Ettore Grillo
PS is happy to post your comment Ettore but we respectfully decline the link and feel it necessary to disclose that links to the publisher of your book may be questionable.
"Why does God allow there to be evil in the world? After all, are we not all created in the image of god?"
Always good for a giggle is OneVike.
[[Job was healed by the grace of God because God wanted to heal him. There is nothing we can do, and that is what Job learned through his trials.]]
Bingo! and again, it;’s important ot realize God may or may not heal us, and that His decision is not based on what we do, but on His Soverieng right as God alone to deal with His creation as He sees fit. In the end, Job didn’t know God was goign to restore Him, so that wasn’t Job’s motivation for repentance- Job repented because He loved God, and because it was the right ting to do regardless of the circumstances he faced.
Alogn with ohter problems- I am dislexic, and so I write this as someoen who suffers and unfortunately wallows in ‘why me’ most of hte time- I do try not to- but find myself crying out ‘why God?” al lthe time- then I resign myself to hte fact that nothign is goign to change, and ‘just accept it’- (but I never truly do accept it- I just ‘give up whining for a time I guess), and I write this to remind me that I’m WAY off trtack in my htinking- Thanks for your insight and responses to put the perspective back where it belongs- I lose track of thigns because I get consumed by the personal experience of suffering, and everythign becoems about me, and I lose the love for fellow man because all I can focuss on is the pain and cry out’ ‘Why God?”
Thanks for your insight and responses to put the perspective back where it belongs
I have been married to a woman who was put in a wheel chair from a car accident we were in a month after we started dating back in 1987 (we were passengers in the back seat).
I have seen her struggle and suffer for more than she deserves, or at least that is my human perspective anyway. However, the true reality is we all deserve what we get, and when we are not getting our just due, that is when we are truly blessed. You are correct that God did not have to heal Job, or else he would have healed the elephant man. Now there was a man who loved God, but like Lazarus, his ultimate healing did not come until he died and went home to be with Christ in the room He had prepared fro him in His fathers mansion. (I just wish I could post a picture of what this man truly looked like. When he found the Lord he never allowed his faith waver regardless of the suffering and ridicule he went through.)
We humans look at this world as if it were something great to hold onto because it is the only thing we know. However it is written:
I think of a child, and how they cannot fathom adulthood, so they want everything now. They cannot even imagine waiting two weeks for a birthday or Christmas. Well, we are God's children, and we too cannot imagine waiting 80 years to get to Christmas. We tell little Johnny that just because Paul's Mommy and Daddy let him have an i-pod does not mean he deserves one. We think that our worth is in this world, but we cannot bring it with, we leave all for our children and they to theirs. One for one, and dust to dust, In Gods due time, and at His pleasure we shall have what he wants us to have and when he wants us to have it.
If that means we must suffer a lifetime from some debilitating disease until we die unknown, unloved by this world, And in poverty, well then so be it. That too is more than we deserve. When men realize this truth, then they will truly see the joy that Christ offers and the burden of worry will be lifted and we will be satisfied with the care we receive from God as promised by Christ.
[[We look at this world as if it is something great to hold onto because it is the only thing we know.]]
Yep- I think that’s it- this life is all we know, and I guess it’s natural to think ‘why does it have to be so difficult osmetiomes?”
[[I think of a child, and how they cannot fathom adulthood, so they want everything now.]]
again- spot on- I was acting pretty childish actually- just focussed on me
[[If that means we must suffer a lifetime from some debilitating disease until we die unknown, unloved by this world, And in poverty, well then so be it. That too is more than we deserve.]]
That was one of hte big issues with me- knowing I’ll probably go out without making an impact, and I guess I just wondered why God woudl even create me to go through life obscure and unimportant-
[[When men realize this truth,]]
Well, I think I got a glimpse of it today- thanks to your comments on Job, even during his suffering, how he prayed for OTHERS intsead of himself- made me realize how focussed on myself I’ve been for far too long now.