by Jack
I rode my bike down to the city center today for an early morning coffee (Pete’s). On my return trip I made a slight detour through the farmers market area aka City Parking Lot A. It get’s converted every weekend into a collection of street venders mostly selling fresh organic produce, but you never know what you’ll find and that is part of what makes it interesting.
As I walked my old mountain bike through the crowd, it struck me there’s almost something foreign about this place. Not just because it’s such an eclectic gathering of odd characters… where hemp products and Jesus sandals abound, or where tie-dye clothing is both a fashion and a political statement, it was something else…hmmm, what could it be?
Then it struck me, there’s no prices on anything! No signs saying beans half off today; no red cabbage at $1.29 per head, here, you had to ask! Maybe it was done this way to open an interaction between buyer and seller, I dunno. But, it was definitely not to haggle over prices. Haggling would have been a major faux paux. This “pay the asked price” concept may have been a spin off those with the anti-corporate and so-called “fair trader” mentality. Wherever it started had evolved to all the venders. Wonder what would happen if you opened a discount tomato stand in their midst?
I have to admit, it was fun to talk with your grocer or vender of crystals, honey, etc. And as to the pricing, well, you have plenty of folks willing pay, especially for certified organics. And to think, in just one quick diversion off the gree painted bike path I left regular downtown and entered Chicolandia with all the ubiquitous fold out canopy tents, new-age hippies, H’mong farmers and assorted artsy/crafty venders.
It was fun break from the traditional grocery stores. So, if go there, you’re going to spend a few extra bucks, but you will get really fresh, and sometimes unique veggies, not to be found anywhere else. I didn’t plan on buying anything, however I came back with a half pound of some really tasty jalapenos and a head of crispy butter lettuce.
I love the Wed. morning Farmer’s Market in the old Mervyn’s now Goodwill store on East Ave.
They have all the in season fruits, veggies and other goodies too. And they have prices marked. Mix what you want into one bag, it’s all $2.00
Yeah, that’s a nice one too.
These local farmers are business people out selling the fruits (and vegetables and flowers and herbs) of their labors…how wonderful! It’s particularly gratifying to see the marketplace tradition that makes small town living so wonderful continue year after year…may it never stop.
The weekend market is a fun zone of cultural variances as Jack described. A word of praise needs to go out the former Market manager (Terry G) who helped build this into what it was, I haven’t been there since she left, so I can’t speak to it current state. Terry always had some kind of promotion or drawing to help the Vendors do better, and bring more people into the Market. I have no doubt she is missed by many, not only the vendors but customers of the market. Yes the market still is a fun morning of shopping for Chico residents. One of the sad points affecting the market is how the City Council wants to relocate it into a smaller area,!(thus reducing the number of vendors ,and many more are on a waiting list that will only get larger) Why??? and for what reason, they(council majority) just will not be forthcoming on why. Chico is changing, and sadly venues like this may disappear in the not to distant future do to Politico gamesmanship. It is sad to lose older traditional escapes, but if your in the path of progressive politics, watch out!
Here are some things that you should know about the Saturday Farmers Market.
The CCFM leases the Municipal Parking Lot 1 for $140.00 PER YEAR. Yes, PER YEAR! Since it is open from 7 am until 1 pm each Saturday, that is 6 hours a week 52 weeks per year for $140.00. That’s about $0.50 per hour. So why is the City renting out City property at such a small amount to a private enterprise? I guess you would have to ask the Progressive controlled City Council. It does seem a little strange for a City that is on the verge of bankruptcy to subsidize a private business.
Before anyone questions whether it is a private business lets take a look at the CCFM; what it is and how it operates. The CCFM rents the lot from the city. It then rents out booths to vendors at a rate of $25 to $30 per week. So it is taking in a reasonable amount of money each Saturday. So what does it do with the money? Well the CCFM is a nonprofit. The City required that it be a nonprofit to get the lease for the parking lot. Since it is a nonprofit it can’t show a profit. So where does the money go? Does it use the money to do good things in our community? Well….. no! The money is used to pay the people that put on the market. In other words, their nonprofit exists to operate the market and make money so they can continue to operate the market and fund their non-profit. Sounds like the real beneficiaries of the market are the market employees. How is this different from any other business? The CCFM is no different than any other business in Chico that makes a profit and uses the money to pay their employees.
So, how much does the market make and who gets it? Well, only the Board of Directors on the CCFM know that. You see, even though the City required the CCFM to be a nonprofit to get the parking lot the CCFM used the only form of a nonprofit (and there are many) that doesn’t have to make their books public. It’s the same form used for country clubs and tennis clubs, etc. Kind of odd isn’t it? But the books are kept close without public scrutiny. We have no idea where it goes. It may all go to payroll or some may go to payroll and the remaining amount might go to other things. Could it be getting back to Progressive political candidates or causes? Well, we just don’t know. But the City still subsidizes this organization by renting out public property are a ridiculous rate.
Another point that needs to be considered even if you buy the idea that the CCFM should be subsidized because it is a nonprofit, where the CCFM is a nonprofit, the vendors for the most part are not. They are for profit businesses. They are the ones that benefit the most.
Again, why is the City subsidizing a private enterprise?
Well. Maybe it’s because it is promoting good food and good food is good for us? Well…. There are many businesses in Chico that promote good food. We don’t subsidize them so that can’t be it. Maybe it is because of the good prices? Well, we all know that isn’t the case.
Maybe it’s because it is fun and a social event. But there are many privately run fun and social events that occur in Chico that can’t get subsidized by the City. I believe several months ago the City turned down some promoter that wanted to put on an event in the park. The reason was that it was a private enterprise. So I guess that can’t be it.
Well maybe the City does it because it helps downtown businesses. Well the fact is it helps some but greatly hurts others. Hurts downtown businesses? How can it do that? It brings 2500 to 5000 people downtown on any given Saturday. That should help businesses. Right? Well that all depends.
When the market was first put together it was half the size it is now and it only had farm products. Then they requested that they be allowed to have prepared food, but only temporarily. Then they made that permanent and asked to be allowed to have seasonal hand crafted products, but only temporarily. Then they made that permanent. Then they needed to take the west driveway for safety reasons. Then it was the east driveway. The market today is very different from what it was originally. It is now competition for many downtown businesses. You can verify all of this by reviewing the original CCFM Franchise agreement and all the amendments made over the years. The documents are available for review at the City offices.
There is another reason the market hurts many downtown businesses. Many of the businesses downtown have had to become unique to survive. The have had to specialize and carry products that don’t directly compete with the big box stores. As a result their customer base has also become specialized and unique. This is simple customer demographics. As a business becomes more and more specialized they become more and more dependent on the customers that come downtown to specifically seek them out and less dependent on customers from the normal foot traffic on the sidewalk. This is because with unique products the foot-traffic customers are far less likely to be part of the business customer demographic group. People come in, but they browse and don’t buy. The customers that seek out the business are much more likely to convert to a sale.
So, on every Saturday, foot traffic increases because of the CCFM but sales go down because the customers that would normally seek out the business stay away because of the congestion and lack of parking as a result of the market. See how it works? A business gets more browsers that don’t convert to a sale but the needed customer base goes somewhere else on Saturday. This effect is very strong close to the market and decreases as you get father away and the congestion and parking problems diminish. Also, the more specialized the business is, the more it is impacted. Businesses that appeal to a broad range of people, such as restaurants (everybody eats), may be positively impacted. But the specialized and unique businesses feel a negative impact. Lynn Brown, the manager of Tower Records when it was located on Main Street once told me that Saturday was the biggest retail day of the week for every Tower Records in the state except one;. Can you guess which one? Yes, Tower Records in Chico was the only Tower Records in the state that saw a decrease in sales. The other Tower Records locations showed the expected Saturday jump in business while in Chico the sales dropped by 25%. He said this was not the case until the CCFM moved to their current location. Many downtown businesses that were in place prior to the CCFM moving to their current location say the same thing.
So helping downtown business is not the reason the City subsidizes the CCFM.
Maybe it is to help the farmers. Well, do the farmers need help? And if you help the farmers shouldn’t you help other businesses? In other words, is it the responsibility of the City to use City resources to help the farmers (or any business for that matter)? Also, a good number of the farmer’s and businesses are from outside of Chico. Should we be helping them? Well, that can’t be it.
OK, I got it! It’s because it is popular. But wait. Trader Joes is popular and we don’t subsidize them. But….. it IS because it is popular; politically popular! I’ve heard members of the CCFM and the Friends of the Farmer’s Market stand up in City Council meetings and City Committee meetings and blatantly politically threaten Council Members because they supported something the CCFM people did not like. I’ve seen City Council members that were aligned with the market try to push trough changes that would benefit the market without following required procedure.
So next time you walk through the Farmer’s Market remember what you see is just the thin visible layer of a very thick economic and political mess that benefits the few at the expense of many. Enjoy!
The comment from Common Sense was one of the best I’ve seen. Really well researched with good points. I had no idea about the money involved and the lease, but then I haven’t been involed with the Farmers Market until now. Well, I learned something and it’s why we do Post Scripts!
Hi, Juanita. Recycling one of your older crabs, I gather.
There is just no pleasing you, girl. If you’ve got a parking place, you want a farmer’s market. If you’ve got a farmer’s market, you want parking places.
You don’t want to pay city staffers, but you want your meeting transcript … and you want it now!
Vastly entertaining.
I am not Libby!
Excuse me. I am not Juanita.
Libby,
I have read your posts over the years. I am not surprised that your comment is an attack on someone rather than addressing the topic. Postscripts, can you confirm I am not Juanita and maybe Libby will have to address something she wants to ignore.
More Common Sense I agree with Jack wholeheartedly. I have only browsed the North Valley Plaza parking lot market myself and I too had no idea. I assumed (yes I know) these were all independent contractors.
I can see that the owner of the lot (downtown its the city) might require a fee to help cover liability insurance but I had no idea that an actual nonprofit was involved or that they were so politically cagey!
I do hope you will join us often. We are here so that the people of Chico, and surrounding areas, can educate and voice their concerns…thank you!
You sure? The post reads astoundingly like something Ms. S. posted on her blog back in January.
Harold got me started. I knew I’d read something about the Farmer’s Market … the rent they pay … should they pay more, be moved? (but then, I know the flea market in San Jose is in the same perdicament) … so I googled, and there she was!
And then you appeared. Coincidence? Nah.
I mean your post does just seeth with the flailing resentments that make Ms. S. so much fun to read.
Yes, the city is subsidizing the local organic growers by providing cheap real estate to set up on. This is going to be a straight up or down thing. Either you approve or you don’t. If you don’t, then you make yet another attempt to boot them wicked liberals off the city counsel. If you can’t do that … you gotta lump it.
Them’s the rules.
I mean, take this bit, for instance:
“It (CCFM) then rents out booths to vendors at a rate of $25 to $30 per week. So it is taking in a reasonable amount of money each Saturday. So what does it do with the money?”
Well, you get out your calculator and, just supposing … does the market run all year? Mine doesn’t. Runs eight months, so … 25 a week for 32 weeks from, say, 50 vendors?
$40,000. Presumably, the CCFM’s chief responsibilities are insurance coverage and advertising. I’ll tell you one thing, nobody’s gettin’ rich here.
In other words, what we have here is yet more irrational, and quite baseless, resentment … for it’s own sake, I swear to Pete!
Libby, it is interesting that you miss the whole point. It was stated many times. Why is the City subsidizing a private enterprise?
And, just because you can stack the City Council so they pass something does not make it the right thing to do. Look at what the Progressives have done to the finances of this town. Are you going to take responsibility because you voted them in?
Libby: “what we have here is yet more irrational, and quite baseless, resentment … for it’s own sake, I swear to Pete!”
I think our poster, More Common Sense, has a lot more than baseless irrational resentment given the length and specificity of his considerations. He sounds like a downtown business person to me who’s own business is negatively impacted. If the farmers gave a rip about the downtown business, and they should, they would find a way to make it work for everyone.
I have never met a liberal who thinks that way, however. It doesn’t occur to you that his considerations could be legitimate and could be included in whatever is worked out by the council!
For all the pretense of concern and compassion you lot are a snarky, selfish bunch.
“Why is the City subsidizing a private enterprise?”
Because it is a valuable enterprise, contributing to the well-being of the citizens, nutritionally and spiritually, and, all too consequently, insupportable via capitalism. So, we liberal citizens have banded together and, via our government, fostered this valuable enterprise.
“And, just because you can stack the City Council ….”
You find the votes, Princess, and you can have it your way.
“Many downtown businesses that were in place prior to the CCFM moving to their current location say the same thing.”
Name them.
I feel for the Tower manager, but let’s try to face facts, worrisome though they may be. The youngsters download all their music now. Oldsters may insist on the re-mastered, East-West, Butterfield Band, CD import … but they buy it off Amazon.
Sad, sad, sad. But I don’t think the CCFM can be blamed.
It’s more like what Jack said, way back there. You come down on yer bike, get yer Peet’s, hit the market, hit the bookstore, have some lunch, make a run through that spiffy antique market, and then head home for your nap. That … is a Saturday worth living.
Libby,
First, I’m 59, male, 6’0″ tall and 225 lbs. Please don’t call me Princess! You are exhibiting one of the many problems I have with the left. No matter how wrong they are they will never accept it. As Reagan said, “It isn’t so much that liberals are ignorant. It’s just that they know so many things that aren’t so.”
Second, I will repeat. Just because the Council votes for it does not make right or in some cases legal. Would it be reasonable for the City Council to vote to pay Walmart’s property taxes? Would you say that was OK? Giving your friends special treatment when you get into office has always been called corruption!
Third, I did not name the businesses that are experiencing problems as a result of the market because I know what the liberal left are like. I have experienced vandalism and harassment from them over this issue. It’s interesting, because they can never dispute my facts. They just want me to shut up OR ELSE!
Fourth, Tower Records all over the state closed up because of downloadable music. That is true. However, the the time period I am referring is when downloading was just starting to happen. IF you had paid attention, the comparison was between the Chico Tower Records and all other Tower Records stores in the state. I doubt the Chico Tower Records was the only one that experienced a downturn in business due to downloads. The comparison was also the Chico Tower Records before the market was on Municipal Lot 1 and after.
Libby, when presented with facts you respond with comments that are off point or irrelevant. You liberals want what you want and who cares what the facts are and who it hurts. You know what is best for everybody. You want to tell parents how to raise their kids. You want to tell people what to eat, what to drive, how to live every part of their lives. You want to tell business how to operate and you wonder why business drops. It is never your fault it is always the fault of someone else. It doesn’t matter that all of your agends have been tried over and over again and have failed every time at a huge cost. What you did and forced others to do was right for you so it has to be right for everybody. I find the liberal left to be one of the most selfish and inflexible people on the planet. Once they make up their minds they want something it doesn’t matter who gets hurt. Everyone has to align with what they want or….. here it is again…. OR ELSE!
First … well, if you say so. But anybody who wants to can compare the two posts and note the similarity. There’s a connection there somewhere.
Second … I said it before, and I’ll say it again (without the “Princess”), get the votes and you too can do what you like, because you like.
Third … if you cannot name a business harassed and/or vandalized for their opposition to the CCFM, I expect it’s because there aren’t any. We will have to have proof, dude. Flailing, baseless, expressions of resentment simply will not cut it. Man up.
Fourth … I shudder at the thought, but Napster, iTunes, they have been with us for some twenty years … and that’s just the legal venues.
Lastly, anybody possessed of the notion that the left is out to force organic produce down their throat … has come entirely unhinged. That is why I have been absent from the site for some time. What can be done with people who will eat worms and die before they jump off that wheel in the hamster cage?
You are all, quite tediously, nuts.
Libby,
Again you respond with nothing of value and comments that don’t fit the discussion.
Get back on your meds!
Michelle Obama’s school healthy lunch program is/was a blatant leftist attempt to control what every child in America eats. (The money and the food were largely wasted since the food went in the garbage)
Bloomberg (yes he’s a leftist) in New York banning salt shakers in restaurants is a blatant leftist attempt to control food preferences of New Yorkers as well as anyone who visits the city.
Of course the left wants to force organic produce, a vegan diet, or any other cockamamie dietary notion that comes down the pike on the public…liberals think they are superior and therefore qualified to control the world. It’s called narcissism and explains why sweet things like you see people with the capability to think for themselves as “nuts”.
A gift from above:
First lady calls summit on food marketing.
This is the way they began when they wanted to control smoking…of course the left wants control…eventually complete control.
The second point that Libby made in her most recent post has really bothered me. It has bothered me because it is one of the root causes of the problems this country is having right now. I believe a politician has a responsibility to represent all of the people in there area of influence. Granted they will be influenced by their own beliefs however they should consider the impact of their decisions on all people. Unfortunately the left believes that being elected to office means you can do whatever you want and you have no responsibility to differing views. You see this in the federal government, state government, and, as Libby points out, in local government. In fact, it appears that the left believes that being in power gives you the right to not only not represent all of the people but to punish people that have differing views. After all, they know what is best about everything and you have to line up, and shut up, or…. here it is once more…OR ELSE. The IRS, EPA, and other government agencies are just tools to eliminate those pesky people that have differing views.
“Michelle Obama’s school healthy lunch program is/was a blatant leftist attempt to control what every child in America eats.”
I’m sorry, but that is just paranoid, cockamamie nonsense. SOMEBODY has always set school lunch menus. And I much prefer Michelle and her greens to Ronald and his “ketchup is a vegetable.”
“Again you respond with nothing of value and comments that don’t fit the discussion.”
In other words, you got nothing in the way of a response? No harrassed business enterprises? … can’t counter there venerability of the music download?
But it does bother you that elected representatives act on the basis of the principals and policies that got them elected. That also seems a little … unhinged.
I have a lot in the way of response. However I think I’m wasting my time.
First point, I’ll only address businesses that have been around before the market moved and have made public their comments relative to their business before and after the market. They are already on the record so I feel safe in just repeating the information. I’m not going to expose any other business to the radical element that exists in the left (or makes up the left) in this town. Both Diamond W and Zucchini & Vine both have discussed the same downturn in business experienced by Tower Records as a result of the Farmer’s Market moving to Municipal Lot 1. Both have made this public in City Council meetings. I’m not going to name any others because it is not the responsible thing to do to subject them to reprisals. I am a downtown business owner. I have done nothing but present my opinion. The cost of doing so has been more that $2000.00 in vandalism and a whole lot of face to face confrontations by people coming into my business to berate me for having an opinion. So I’m not going to do that to someone else.
Second point, music downloading has nothing to do with this issue! You must have a significant problem with reading comprehension Libby. I never said that Tower Records in Chico closed as a result of the Farmer’s Market. Look at my posts you blithering nitwit. All of the Tower Records locations in California were experiencing the same effects of downloading (if any) at that time. Do you honestly think that downloads affected Chico and no other town? Even with all the stores experiencing whatever other market pressures were occurring ALL of the locations showed an upturn on Saturday except the Chico store which showed a downturn. It has not a bit to do with downloads you blathering crone!
Your want to talk about principals of the representatives that are elected? OK, lets talk. Tom Nickel attempted to expand the Farmers Market several years ago. He did this in the Internal Affairs Committee. His basis was for safety which was later determined to be a non-issue. However, it that is the issue he used. He put it on the agenda of the IAC and attempted to push it through in that one meeting. There was only one person at the meeting that represented the downtown businesses, and that person was there only because he had coffee with Jim Walker the day before the meeting and found out about the focus of the meeting. In the meeting Nickel stated that all affected parties, including downtown businesses, had been notified of the meeting and the topic. A check with a large group of downtown businesses showed this was a lie. Allowing the market to expand would have gone through that meeting except the City attorney indicated that it would go against legal procedure. You should have seen the look on his face. He was not only angry but looked very defeated. He did not run for election after that. It seems he was dispatched by the market overseers to get what they wanted and he failed! Hey, that’s why Randall Stone was supported instead of Nickel!
Libby, this it it. Unless you can come up with a comment that intelligently addresses something I said I will not respond. If you do I will respond. But, as far as I’m concerned you have relegated yourself to the dustbin of buffoonery. Stand on your street corner and blather on with no relevance!
More Common Sense…. ah, I see it didn’t take long for you to tangle with Libby. lol Welcome to my world. Actually you should consider it validation of your “common sense” when Libby goes after you. We love her as a person who cares about people, but we almost never agree with anything she says on politics because she’s way left of Stalin. lol
Libby: I’m sorry, but that is just paranoid, cockamamie nonsense. SOMEBODY has always set school lunch menus.”
Yeah…adults at the local level where they can observe how the menu is received and spend the allocated money wisely from the perspective of nutrition AND expense/waste!
Michelle’s heart may be in the right place but her program is not working (Kids aren’t buying or are throwing it away). When Washington DC presumes to tell adults in Chico California what be on the menu the intent is central control!
“And I much prefer Michelle and her greens to Ronald and his “ketchup is a vegetable.”
Ketchup would fall in the fruits and vegetables category. And your argument is just as silly as whatever question prompted that response!